Freewriting? Follow-Up
Jul. 15th, 2021 11:19 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
madimpossibledreamerI just continue to continue this dialogue with myself this week. Also it's not quite freewriting because I did go back in and add a few things.
one random section where I started writing in lower case, I think so I could emphasize certain things and so I could lowercase joss.
warnings: discussion of discrimination against lgbtq+, joss whedon specifically being the Nice Guy(TM) complete with harassment, and reproductive coercion (not specifically related to joss, though he definitely was guilty of that with Charisma)
spoilers, specifically for the romance plotline with anya
the avengers points is a slight thing at the end but it ties in to the main themes so.
Although tbf maybe it's a blessing we didn't get 'gay xander' because Joss's endgame was xander/buffy and as bad as the killing your gays trope is I have a feeling there would have been some sort of gross 'conversion therapy' or 'just a phase' type storyline to make way for the endgame ship
(...which, uh...does that mean that btvs was supposed to be a self-insert/oc of his dreams deal?? ...that realization means I take everything back about the ships especially if you rewrite it to be less problematic than he did; this is basically that guy whining about 'that boyfriend's not good for you I am a million times better I'll treat you right', except he writes rpf fanfic of it.
they were written on purpose to be toxic because joss is toxic and jealous through a self insert & probably ooc too)
Also tbh his is probably why xander was written as such an ass about 'you're not dating me'.
Also, not that you need my permission, but you do you. I like to reclaim Xander as a character from the asshat-in-charge and his flying monkeys. If it makes you feel better to list Xander's many bad qualities or stay away from him altogether, do it! you have a right to decide what makes you feel safe and happy, no one else. keep being your awesome self!
more thoughts: actually, if we're treating this like fanfic, it means joss is a terrible fanfic writer. one of the things you learn in Fanfic 101 is: "character assassinations to ensure your readers will accept mc/oc as better than Canon" backfire. a lot. i think there's actually a entire article on Springhole about that.
how to handle it gracefully, like an adult? like a good writer? adult relationships are about more than just chemistry. (just a reminder that a lot of the stuff i know about relationships comes from captain awkward and the internet/writing sites, but it's been pretty good insight.) just because you can be great friends and get along doesn't mean your aspirations won't clash, or that they shouldn't be valued too. for example? point out that mc doesn't want kids. Canon romantic interest does. neither are willing to compromise. if neither are willing to budge, the mature thing to do is not to stay in the relationship, hoping one will change their mind, or sabotage the birth control (maybe he nukes the birth control, maybe she gets him drunk and insists they have sex without a condom, it can go either way and it's EQUALLY TERRIBLE no matter who does it or how). get out with mutual respect and go find a romantic partner who shares your dreams for the future.
it's one of the reasons, as badly written as it was, the 'ditching Anya' thing sort of worked for me, because I could see their goals as being at odds. 1) Anya was definitely more into sex than Xander was. Or, well, probably anyone else we saw on screen. Go with the idea of Xander as ace or grey-ace, and problems could happen even if he wasn't sex-averse (which I think would be harder to read into canon especially without the unfortunate conflation of it and ptsd from Faith). 2) Anya valued money a whole lot more. Xander liked it (esp trying to 'show off with new wheels'), but mainly from a 'prove I'm not poor trash' angle, rather than for its own merits. When push came to shove, she wanted the white picket fence deal. He couldn't walk away from The Good Fight. She thought that it was just because of a crush and therefore an aspiration with little value. Even if she was right, being in a relationship with someone who devalues the things you find important is not particularly healthy.
I had a 3, but I forgot it. Remembered it since copying it! 3) Alcoholism in the family. Therapy is, uh, not particularly present or shown in the best light in Buffy, so it's not a solution. Alcoholism can definitely have a genetic component and it is definitely a thing that it can bring out the worst in people. Add the hints of abuse (the mom having to drink to even deal with him), the fact that the Harrises are not looked upon favorably in the town, all the internalized toxic masculinity b.s. that each successive generation has been instilling in the new blood, and that's a pretty bad combo. If Xander ever did become an alcoholic, that could easily be a black hole with no exit (especially if mental health help doesn't exist or is fundamentally broken in the worlds Joss imagines).
Still, you get the idea. #1 could be talked through/compromised for, but if not handled carefully could easily end a relationship on its own, even in the real world. #2 is so much at odds that the idea that even without an accident pulling Xander out of the field, it could lead to this situation of resentment, is completely understandable. (Since demon, we can't be 100% sure that #2 was completely correct and not just Xander's worries, but it fits with what else we know.) #3 can't be solved from within the relationship, but if it comes up and it's not solved that's not a healthy place for anyone to be. And there's nothing wrong with the first two things, and alcoholism might not be an active choice that you made, but the first stances in #1 and #2 aren't necessarily reconcilable, and a single love interest is not enough to "fix" somebody.
What makes this harder is that Western society at least (I'm not an expert on other povs so I want to add this as a disclaimer) is that a relationship failing is always presented as a 'failure of love', so that if something's wrong, obviously they don't love each other enough. Which, no, sometimes you love and respect each other enough to realize it's not working and you're just going to end up hating each other if you keep having to sacrifice your dreams for each other. So, basically, if Joss was a better writer or a mature person he could write this kind of thing (all the stuff with Anya, I swear, is an accident that they didn't even recognize was there when they wrote it as a 'failed relationship' solely because they wanted more drama). But, uh...tbf, it's not even the last time he got weirdly over-invested about breaking up a fictional romance he didn't like (side-eyeing him for breaking up Tony and Pepper).
It's not like any of this is new info, it's just...recontextualized.
one random section where I started writing in lower case, I think so I could emphasize certain things and so I could lowercase joss.
warnings: discussion of discrimination against lgbtq+, joss whedon specifically being the Nice Guy(TM) complete with harassment, and reproductive coercion (not specifically related to joss, though he definitely was guilty of that with Charisma)
spoilers, specifically for the romance plotline with anya
the avengers points is a slight thing at the end but it ties in to the main themes so.
Although tbf maybe it's a blessing we didn't get 'gay xander' because Joss's endgame was xander/buffy and as bad as the killing your gays trope is I have a feeling there would have been some sort of gross 'conversion therapy' or 'just a phase' type storyline to make way for the endgame ship
(...which, uh...does that mean that btvs was supposed to be a self-insert/oc of his dreams deal?? ...that realization means I take everything back about the ships especially if you rewrite it to be less problematic than he did; this is basically that guy whining about 'that boyfriend's not good for you I am a million times better I'll treat you right', except he writes rpf fanfic of it.
they were written on purpose to be toxic because joss is toxic and jealous through a self insert & probably ooc too)
Also tbh his is probably why xander was written as such an ass about 'you're not dating me'.
Also, not that you need my permission, but you do you. I like to reclaim Xander as a character from the asshat-in-charge and his flying monkeys. If it makes you feel better to list Xander's many bad qualities or stay away from him altogether, do it! you have a right to decide what makes you feel safe and happy, no one else. keep being your awesome self!
more thoughts: actually, if we're treating this like fanfic, it means joss is a terrible fanfic writer. one of the things you learn in Fanfic 101 is: "character assassinations to ensure your readers will accept mc/oc as better than Canon" backfire. a lot. i think there's actually a entire article on Springhole about that.
how to handle it gracefully, like an adult? like a good writer? adult relationships are about more than just chemistry. (just a reminder that a lot of the stuff i know about relationships comes from captain awkward and the internet/writing sites, but it's been pretty good insight.) just because you can be great friends and get along doesn't mean your aspirations won't clash, or that they shouldn't be valued too. for example? point out that mc doesn't want kids. Canon romantic interest does. neither are willing to compromise. if neither are willing to budge, the mature thing to do is not to stay in the relationship, hoping one will change their mind, or sabotage the birth control (maybe he nukes the birth control, maybe she gets him drunk and insists they have sex without a condom, it can go either way and it's EQUALLY TERRIBLE no matter who does it or how). get out with mutual respect and go find a romantic partner who shares your dreams for the future.
it's one of the reasons, as badly written as it was, the 'ditching Anya' thing sort of worked for me, because I could see their goals as being at odds. 1) Anya was definitely more into sex than Xander was. Or, well, probably anyone else we saw on screen. Go with the idea of Xander as ace or grey-ace, and problems could happen even if he wasn't sex-averse (which I think would be harder to read into canon especially without the unfortunate conflation of it and ptsd from Faith). 2) Anya valued money a whole lot more. Xander liked it (esp trying to 'show off with new wheels'), but mainly from a 'prove I'm not poor trash' angle, rather than for its own merits. When push came to shove, she wanted the white picket fence deal. He couldn't walk away from The Good Fight. She thought that it was just because of a crush and therefore an aspiration with little value. Even if she was right, being in a relationship with someone who devalues the things you find important is not particularly healthy.
I had a 3, but I forgot it. Remembered it since copying it! 3) Alcoholism in the family. Therapy is, uh, not particularly present or shown in the best light in Buffy, so it's not a solution. Alcoholism can definitely have a genetic component and it is definitely a thing that it can bring out the worst in people. Add the hints of abuse (the mom having to drink to even deal with him), the fact that the Harrises are not looked upon favorably in the town, all the internalized toxic masculinity b.s. that each successive generation has been instilling in the new blood, and that's a pretty bad combo. If Xander ever did become an alcoholic, that could easily be a black hole with no exit (especially if mental health help doesn't exist or is fundamentally broken in the worlds Joss imagines).
Still, you get the idea. #1 could be talked through/compromised for, but if not handled carefully could easily end a relationship on its own, even in the real world. #2 is so much at odds that the idea that even without an accident pulling Xander out of the field, it could lead to this situation of resentment, is completely understandable. (Since demon, we can't be 100% sure that #2 was completely correct and not just Xander's worries, but it fits with what else we know.) #3 can't be solved from within the relationship, but if it comes up and it's not solved that's not a healthy place for anyone to be. And there's nothing wrong with the first two things, and alcoholism might not be an active choice that you made, but the first stances in #1 and #2 aren't necessarily reconcilable, and a single love interest is not enough to "fix" somebody.
What makes this harder is that Western society at least (I'm not an expert on other povs so I want to add this as a disclaimer) is that a relationship failing is always presented as a 'failure of love', so that if something's wrong, obviously they don't love each other enough. Which, no, sometimes you love and respect each other enough to realize it's not working and you're just going to end up hating each other if you keep having to sacrifice your dreams for each other. So, basically, if Joss was a better writer or a mature person he could write this kind of thing (all the stuff with Anya, I swear, is an accident that they didn't even recognize was there when they wrote it as a 'failed relationship' solely because they wanted more drama). But, uh...tbf, it's not even the last time he got weirdly over-invested about breaking up a fictional romance he didn't like (side-eyeing him for breaking up Tony and Pepper).
It's not like any of this is new info, it's just...recontextualized.